I was one of the founding members of WEP but, appalled at its willingness to ignore its members, I contacted them last year to say I was cancelling my membership. I was persuaded to hang on in there by the implementation of a ‘sex matters’ caucus, and have been in touch with them today regarding Reid's statement. They say they are making a statement tomorrow, but my hopes aren’t high. I refuse to continue funding an organisation that refuses to support those very women it was set up to represent.
(Apart from anything else, Reid’s videoed statement was nauseating to watch and hear. She appears to see herself as a powerful and persuasive orator. She really isn’t.)
And there it is, more often than not: behind every colonisation of a place for woman is an AGP male, or the parent of a 'trans child', deeply in the grip of Cognitive Dissonance.
I joined right at the start but I left last year. What a shame, what a shambles what a con. They never answered my questions just totally ignored them. Good grief we’re not stupid.
'I am excited by the new frontiers that open up with self-ID and non-binary identities' said Mandu Reid. Unfortunately, too many men are also excited by these new frontiers opening up for them, leaving women and children vulnerable to their predations. I can't think how many levels of stupid you have to have to not see the dangers.
This is all true. I was on the Advisory Group of the Members Assembly and was never allowed to see the results of the answers to the questions Nat Cen chose from their observations of the discussions after the presentations by the chosen witnesses. Sport was not allowed to be discussed as “WEP hasn’t got a policy on that” and Gina Rippon was not allowed to present her evidence on “health” (which is a policy area) as the ”self ID side” couldn’t find or didn’t look for anyone who could or would argue against her. So that policy area was ignored completely.
But where is the quotation from that suggests WEP has 30,000 members. If you look at their published financial accounts and the numbers of members their database registers they have never had more than 9000. The spin is always “members and supporters” when numbers are mentioned. That is very disingenuous indeed.
Were some well-connected women just having a bit of a play at politics at he 'top' of the WEP? I watched it unfold with some fascination. From the comments here it seems like all the intelligent and engaged ones raised their concerns and were very deliberately kept well away from making any of the key decisions, time and time again. I have noticed the tumbleweed from the press and Westminster. Whatever happened to...the WEP? Like Labour who appear to have almost entirely disappeared from Parli. We sort of know what the Greens are doing - and they gained many new members here because of that. In order to vote, in order to get our voices heard.
Yes. As hard as this is we must stop being so damn loyal and vote with our feet. And if that doesn't work, move and vote again somewhere else. Try not to let apathyshame or hopelessness engulf us. And hope those who came before us would understand why we are leaving the parties they fought and worked for. Believed in, or as the least worst option. Parties mutated and forgot too much. I guess because of a generation(s) and class(es) of 'professional' politician who never meets other people who aren't other 'professional' politicians and only sees the inside of their own bubble. And the others who are along for the ride.
They are so arrogant that they think it will never happen to them. When it does, they will applaud with gritted teeth then move on to their next self-promotional hobby.
Equality in name only. What's new? The only surprise is it has taken this long for more people to start noticing. Just as eagle-eyed money-makers are jumping on the TRA bandwagon to get easy funding and career prospects, the same thing happened to "feminism" years ago. The same thing happens with the word "equality" in every possible sector. I don't give myself any labels because it reduces us to what the best-funded spokespeople on the market are promoting. I'm a woman and I'll fight for what is right, nothing trendy can be added to that.
Keep fighting. I was invited to contribute at a mentulelfndiversityequalitee meeting today. They forgot key aspects of the Equality Act 2010 in how they conducted the online meeting. Many had to point this out, some incredibly entertainingly and rather angrily as the organisers tried to shut them down. It genuinely is just paying lip-service for many. Too many appear ignorant of their ignorance and have long and well-remunerated careers in public service, and the public sector, despite this.
Any of you reading this, attending any professional meeting, just mention EA2010 where relevant and it will show who is spouting out of their elbows (or is that ar*es?). Those who look a bit nervous or go quiet, and say, great point, I'll get back to you on that. The type that blame the person or service not in the meeting.
Shocking that ST is going along with this 🤔 Is it worth joining in order to have a voice or is it too far gone? The problem is if it is viewed as a stakeholder organisation and given a seat at the table to represent ‘women’s’ views on self ID.
It's too far gone I'm afraid. I was a member from its inception until I left last year over their betrayal. They've been knowingly underhand for many years and, ironically, the party is run much less democratically than any other UK party I know of.
Best to donate to crowd funding women who are actually standing up for our rights. WEP are pushing hard to diminish them.
Alternatively, there are "gender critical" caususes (sub-groups) for all the main parties and even the WEP! The Labour one is Labour Women's Declaration, Conservatives: Conservatives for Women (@CforWomenUK), etc. They are all on Twitter where they agree substantially on core issues, of course!
Sharhar Ali is standing for Chair of the Greens and he is firmly "gender critical". There was an interview of various candidates on LBC with Ian Dale as interviewer recently. Ali was the only coherent candidate. Dale was reticent as he knows that this subject is dynamite (STILL, even after Maya Forstater!)
It's an absolutely shocking organisation. A bit like the Fawcett Society. Any woman who thinks that "compromise" with a transactivist is possible is living in the same delusional state as he is.
I wrote asking about just this approx a year ago and eventually received an answer stating that indeed there would be a full consultation. But I've heard no more until I read this. It's a sad, sorry situation - with the Greens, Labour, SNP and Lib Dems all fully signed up to gender woo-woo just where/how can we vote? Boris and chums' party holds no appeal, yet ironically, they do seem aware of the importance of the many complex and contentious issues entwined in 'gender identity' WTF? Effectively, dissenting female voices are now pretty much cut out from democracy unless we also want to vote for privilege, tax cuts for the rich, jobs for mates etc etc.
Yes, Sandi too is clearly more interested in her media career than in expressing any views that might jeopardise this. Yet sometimes I think all it would take to tip the balance would be one more voice such as hers stating something sane, logical and reasoned.
Never meet your heroes was always the advice, and I for sure feel a little abandoned by the reality of the impressions that some people have created. I used to admire Sandi and now when we need her most she is silent. It's nice to hear when people meet Graham they are usually very happy! That says a lot.
A relative used to work for Have I Got News For You and I had the chance to meet one of my favourite comedians, Eddie Izzard, after filming one day. I decided against - what would I say to him without wibbling? Turns out he's a nasty egotist at best*/having a slow-motion breakdown about his mother's death, enabled by his showbiz pals referring to him as 'she'. Sandi Toksvig is probably one of them and like lots of people their understandable desire to not hurt her friend has compromised her ability to be useful to women.
Though back in 2015 many more of us still thought that TW were harmless, probably gay and had had their bits removed. I certainly thought that and am ashamed to admit I signed that petition for Hudson to be move to a women's jail. We had no idea about him and what he was in reality - just the usual sob story, playing on our emotions, making us feel he was just like us and how would we fare if we had to serve time in a men's prison? If I could take back my signature I would in a heartbeat. Never making that mistake again.
Well said and for being so open about that. I have to remember to try not to shame people into thinking what I think or know. Shame rarely works, but easy to do.
I was one of the founding members of WEP but, appalled at its willingness to ignore its members, I contacted them last year to say I was cancelling my membership. I was persuaded to hang on in there by the implementation of a ‘sex matters’ caucus, and have been in touch with them today regarding Reid's statement. They say they are making a statement tomorrow, but my hopes aren’t high. I refuse to continue funding an organisation that refuses to support those very women it was set up to represent.
(Apart from anything else, Reid’s videoed statement was nauseating to watch and hear. She appears to see herself as a powerful and persuasive orator. She really isn’t.)
And there it is, more often than not: behind every colonisation of a place for woman is an AGP male, or the parent of a 'trans child', deeply in the grip of Cognitive Dissonance.
Any parent who is advocating loudly for their "trans child" is guilty of child abuse and aiding and abetting self harm.
I joined right at the start but I left last year. What a shame, what a shambles what a con. They never answered my questions just totally ignored them. Good grief we’re not stupid.
Same
Ditto.
'I am excited by the new frontiers that open up with self-ID and non-binary identities' said Mandu Reid. Unfortunately, too many men are also excited by these new frontiers opening up for them, leaving women and children vulnerable to their predations. I can't think how many levels of stupid you have to have to not see the dangers.
Yeah, the New Frontier for men of the female changing rooms of the Training Pool at my local leisure centre...
Do any women go now?
Again, the concept of a trans child is liken to a vegan cat.
This is all true. I was on the Advisory Group of the Members Assembly and was never allowed to see the results of the answers to the questions Nat Cen chose from their observations of the discussions after the presentations by the chosen witnesses. Sport was not allowed to be discussed as “WEP hasn’t got a policy on that” and Gina Rippon was not allowed to present her evidence on “health” (which is a policy area) as the ”self ID side” couldn’t find or didn’t look for anyone who could or would argue against her. So that policy area was ignored completely.
But where is the quotation from that suggests WEP has 30,000 members. If you look at their published financial accounts and the numbers of members their database registers they have never had more than 9000. The spin is always “members and supporters” when numbers are mentioned. That is very disingenuous indeed.
Were some well-connected women just having a bit of a play at politics at he 'top' of the WEP? I watched it unfold with some fascination. From the comments here it seems like all the intelligent and engaged ones raised their concerns and were very deliberately kept well away from making any of the key decisions, time and time again. I have noticed the tumbleweed from the press and Westminster. Whatever happened to...the WEP? Like Labour who appear to have almost entirely disappeared from Parli. We sort of know what the Greens are doing - and they gained many new members here because of that. In order to vote, in order to get our voices heard.
Liberal feminists are the worst kind of feminist. In fact it’s an oxymoron - heavy emphasis on the moron
Aye...👍 Sprung up fully formed from non struggle. Heavy oan the 'equality' and light tae zero on the liberation side. Loved the emphasis.😁
Fucking HELL. That is all I have got to say.
I did like many women joined thinking at last and this is it but soon realised it wasnt what it said on the tin.
And like those women still in Labour *thinking they are making inroads why any women bother is beyond me.
Yes. As hard as this is we must stop being so damn loyal and vote with our feet. And if that doesn't work, move and vote again somewhere else. Try not to let apathyshame or hopelessness engulf us. And hope those who came before us would understand why we are leaving the parties they fought and worked for. Believed in, or as the least worst option. Parties mutated and forgot too much. I guess because of a generation(s) and class(es) of 'professional' politician who never meets other people who aren't other 'professional' politicians and only sees the inside of their own bubble. And the others who are along for the ride.
yep - its only when the membership leave do they think 'hang on'..but as you say the professional 'classes' dont recognise anyone else.
The world divides ever more and splits.
Understandable women from different political persuasions on different matters (right / left) … but women who want men in women's spaces!
How did they get so far removed from reality that they will accept men as women.!
How do they not see they will be thrown under the bus when trans women come in and want their positions!
They are so arrogant that they think it will never happen to them. When it does, they will applaud with gritted teeth then move on to their next self-promotional hobby.
Equality in name only. What's new? The only surprise is it has taken this long for more people to start noticing. Just as eagle-eyed money-makers are jumping on the TRA bandwagon to get easy funding and career prospects, the same thing happened to "feminism" years ago. The same thing happens with the word "equality" in every possible sector. I don't give myself any labels because it reduces us to what the best-funded spokespeople on the market are promoting. I'm a woman and I'll fight for what is right, nothing trendy can be added to that.
Keep fighting. I was invited to contribute at a mentulelfndiversityequalitee meeting today. They forgot key aspects of the Equality Act 2010 in how they conducted the online meeting. Many had to point this out, some incredibly entertainingly and rather angrily as the organisers tried to shut them down. It genuinely is just paying lip-service for many. Too many appear ignorant of their ignorance and have long and well-remunerated careers in public service, and the public sector, despite this.
Any of you reading this, attending any professional meeting, just mention EA2010 where relevant and it will show who is spouting out of their elbows (or is that ar*es?). Those who look a bit nervous or go quiet, and say, great point, I'll get back to you on that. The type that blame the person or service not in the meeting.
Shocking that ST is going along with this 🤔 Is it worth joining in order to have a voice or is it too far gone? The problem is if it is viewed as a stakeholder organisation and given a seat at the table to represent ‘women’s’ views on self ID.
It's too far gone I'm afraid. I was a member from its inception until I left last year over their betrayal. They've been knowingly underhand for many years and, ironically, the party is run much less democratically than any other UK party I know of.
Best to donate to crowd funding women who are actually standing up for our rights. WEP are pushing hard to diminish them.
Alternatively, there are "gender critical" caususes (sub-groups) for all the main parties and even the WEP! The Labour one is Labour Women's Declaration, Conservatives: Conservatives for Women (@CforWomenUK), etc. They are all on Twitter where they agree substantially on core issues, of course!
Do you know of one for the Greens?
It might be @gencritgreen with website https://gendercriticalgreens.wordpress.com/
But this may be a New Zealand group.
Sharhar Ali is standing for Chair of the Greens and he is firmly "gender critical". There was an interview of various candidates on LBC with Ian Dale as interviewer recently. Ali was the only coherent candidate. Dale was reticent as he knows that this subject is dynamite (STILL, even after Maya Forstater!)
Thanks. I've voted for Sharhar; hope he can turn things around
Same here!
Yes... Drop them a line at greenfeministsuk@gmail.com they have an email list advising on how to support GC Greens in internal elections.
I have an email address but given hostility too nervous to share .. follow @shahrarali you’ll find them xx
It's an absolutely shocking organisation. A bit like the Fawcett Society. Any woman who thinks that "compromise" with a transactivist is possible is living in the same delusional state as he is.
Like the Fawskin Society, yes?
Arf
I wrote asking about just this approx a year ago and eventually received an answer stating that indeed there would be a full consultation. But I've heard no more until I read this. It's a sad, sorry situation - with the Greens, Labour, SNP and Lib Dems all fully signed up to gender woo-woo just where/how can we vote? Boris and chums' party holds no appeal, yet ironically, they do seem aware of the importance of the many complex and contentious issues entwined in 'gender identity' WTF? Effectively, dissenting female voices are now pretty much cut out from democracy unless we also want to vote for privilege, tax cuts for the rich, jobs for mates etc etc.
Yes, Sandi too is clearly more interested in her media career than in expressing any views that might jeopardise this. Yet sometimes I think all it would take to tip the balance would be one more voice such as hers stating something sane, logical and reasoned.
Never meet your heroes was always the advice, and I for sure feel a little abandoned by the reality of the impressions that some people have created. I used to admire Sandi and now when we need her most she is silent. It's nice to hear when people meet Graham they are usually very happy! That says a lot.
A relative used to work for Have I Got News For You and I had the chance to meet one of my favourite comedians, Eddie Izzard, after filming one day. I decided against - what would I say to him without wibbling? Turns out he's a nasty egotist at best*/having a slow-motion breakdown about his mother's death, enabled by his showbiz pals referring to him as 'she'. Sandi Toksvig is probably one of them and like lots of people their understandable desire to not hurt her friend has compromised her ability to be useful to women.
*https://manatwork68.medium.com/my-first-day-out-by-eddie-izzard-c8ff9bcae245
More here, from Mumsnet. Note the Guest post with Sandy Toksvig mentioned on the thread, back in 2015! https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4058470-the-big-lie-how-the-wep-was-always-about-gender-rather-than-sex
Back in 2015, WEP had just tweeted their support for Tara Hudson and his 7-inch surprise to be moved to a women's prison. Sandi Toksvig ignored the many questions about this and then Sophie Walker appeared, to offer her pledge to recognise gender identity over sex: https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/guest_posts/2502963-Guest-post-Sandi-Toksvig-The-time-is-right-for-the-Womens-Equality-Party
Though back in 2015 many more of us still thought that TW were harmless, probably gay and had had their bits removed. I certainly thought that and am ashamed to admit I signed that petition for Hudson to be move to a women's jail. We had no idea about him and what he was in reality - just the usual sob story, playing on our emotions, making us feel he was just like us and how would we fare if we had to serve time in a men's prison? If I could take back my signature I would in a heartbeat. Never making that mistake again.
Well said and for being so open about that. I have to remember to try not to shame people into thinking what I think or know. Shame rarely works, but easy to do.
Yes. They did a number on us.
What a massive let down
Is this Google man (donor or employee of WEP or both?) named anywhere? I would very much like to know who he is.That is not a threat, btw.