My SJW daughter is now coming round to the idea that this ideology may actually be harmful to Women. She said, and I quote "I've been trying for over a year to become a Mother, and when I eventually do, they're going to try and take the title away from me. Well fuck that, no way, they're not getting away with it" ... who 'they' are that she's referencing isn't clear, but I think deep down she knows who THEY are. The tide is turning finally!! 👏👏👏
One can only hope. The 30-something women my husband works with seem utterly brain-damaged. Their fragile identities would topple if you took away their support of trans, prostitution, etc.
I am 89 and birthed 4 kids in 5 years, before I became a lesbian, I realised that lesbians also have no idea what it is to be a mother......so it is high time that we all look at our navel and remind ourselves where we came from!
I really needed to read this today. It’s been nearly a year fighting Australia’s wreckless national breastfeeding organisation as it throws its doors wide open to these unstable men pretending to being breastfeeding mothers and expels anyone that tries to stop them.
One of the most primal words that we all share in some form or another... Mother. It must be like bitter ashes in their throat to even say it. Sadly nothing that these crazed lunatics get up to these days is surprising anymore, and perhaps that is the most insidious aspect of it.
Can you please do your best to tell your fellow men how destructive the crazed lunatics are? We need more male support to point out that the Emperor has no clothes.
I told the guys I work with about Sarah, the woman fighting for a women's only rape survivor's support group in Sussex. Most presumed all trans women had had the chop or when gay. I explained that with self id, any of them could claim to be a woman without even the need of slapping on some lipstick and attend a survivors group, no questions asked. When asked, how would you feel if it was your wife, sister or daughter having to relive her assault in front of a guy who may be there for legit reasons or may be there to top up the ol wa*k bank. That hit home.
At this point I think the people I work with might think I'm a stuck record. The Prof Stock case has been a real eye opener to a fair few of them though.
Thanks for the read this after breakfast warning. Thank you Genevieve and StillTish.
We know that pregnancy is a dangerous time for women because their male partners or relatives can get jealous and lacking the attention they want apparently makes them violent. Dynamics can shift. It is a known point where domestic abuse begins or escalates. Many pregnant women and mothers of babies and small children are at risk and need the use of safe spaces and shelter. BUT WHAT ABOUT THE MEN? WHAT ABOUT ME ME ME? What about the egos of the grown adult men who are having to adjust. Men abuse and kill women and their children when trying to escape this. Because leaving domestic abuse and coercive and controlling men is also a time of heightened risk. Anything that doesn't centre the man and his needs. Wider communities and families are still not understanding any of this. This is why we still need refuges and safe spaces and places. Sanctuary.
The more time that passes, the more this feels just like all the same old, same old. I once met a men's rights activist who had a bunch of ludicrous stats on how many women kill their partners. His visceral anger at his ex partner 'getting his kid' and his inability to see how he came across to me a complete stranger. It was instructive meeting him. I had to sit next to him in a workshop, but he revealed that he 'knew' me from around the town we live in. He'd worked in security and on the tills in shops and had seen me walk past over a number of years, or out and about, and therefore 'knew me'. He knew where I shopped. It was creepy. He was that type of unaware, verging on delusional and with the self-reinforcing fantasies that many men seem to comfort themselves with. Some women do this too, like Zoe Williams. How common is this twisted and warped male or misogynistic perception? They are the masters of the universe and they treat us like prey. That any violence towards women is deserved and she and we must have been nagging and asking for it.
This behaviour I see as the same. The sudden declaration or 'revelation of his true self' that a man identifies as a woman at that point in a woman's life is the same mess of envy, control, instability and inability to look outside of yourself and to the needs of others. I want, so I must have and own. If I can't have I must destroy. How is that any different from this bunch colonising our every experience? And not centering them is literal violence?
Pregnancy is just stuffing some plastic object up a hole to squeeze it out is it? And people - some men - are unable to separate this sexual fetish and pleasure from the act of carrying and giving birth? Then feeding and nurturing that child? There will be a snake oil salesman out there to sell us anything we can imagine or desire. Why are we pandering to this?
Reminds me and straight back to Mridul and the provision of safe spaces for vulnerable women and girls - this is the inability to distinguish male sexual violence and control from female pain or pleasure. And in a Rape Crisis Centre and travelling the UK to 'teach' communities about this. As some kind of expert. It's all the same to him. He shows his maleness through his public comments, let alone his actions, behaviour and inability to understand why. How is his demand to have women 'retrained' not yet more dominance and control. I don't want to imagine being a young mum going online as she needs help and support and facing this. Think of the men, as always, we must think of the men. Can we all do a check, is any man feeling some moment of doubt that this is all and always about him and his needs? Can't have that now can we?
Once the nausea passed, anger replaced this very quickly. Anger at other women, condoning this, and giving a helping hand in making us wither away, to what ? Pander to fetishists mimicking birth and feeding babies ?
Where did we go so wrong ?
How did this type of abomination become acceptable to those hashtag be kind types ?
The T can’t disappear from the LGB T, quick enough, this is not my world.
Thank goodness I read this before eating. I thought the faux pregnancy dude was sick enough, but seeing these disgusting creeps using hormones to force lactation to wank off is truly the most vomit inducing fetish I’ve seen. I recall seeing an article or a Twitter piece about a MTF who used hormones to actually breast feed a baby. I was disturbed by the fetish and furious at any medical professionals encouraging or condoning this practice. Pity that poor sweet baby, being fed a diet of synthetic hormones so a man can get some sick orgasmic thrill out of pretending to be a woman. That anyone could view that as anything other than gross child abuse and pedophilia is beyond me. Fucking criminal!
Yep, and the medical professionals bent over backwards to help him so he coukd have this 'experience'. Women that have issues are told get on with it or just use a bottle, they are made feel a failure and are judged for not breastfeeding.
To be a young mother-to-be in 2021 must feel like walking through a minefield. Enough! Time for kink-shaming to make a comeback. Push this all the way back to the rock from under which it crawled. Nasty, fetid nonsense.
I feel sick, almost paralysed with revulsion...and an anger that is a TSUNAMI....spreading throughout me! I want to shout and scream and rage...and I want to confront all these sinisterly sick, mentally deranged humans who are allowing ANY of this to happen.
Thank you for highlight all these horrors... #WomenWontWheesht!
A doula? Do they have midwives any more? They're presumably forbidden to call themselves midwives. But what depressingly mediocre journalism! The paragraph just before the one quoted in the article goes like this:
"One side of the debate doesn’t think trans people are real; they might feel what they feel, but the rest of us don’t have to join them in that reality. If someone tried to engage me in an animal rights debate in which I was first required to prove that animals existed, I’d ask them to come back later."
Aside from the fact that this is a straw man since nobody thinks trans people aren't real - only that objective models of reality cannot be built upon the subjective experiences of people who feel that they belong to the opposite sex they actually are - which is two quite different things - the discussion in ZWs article isn't actually about whether trans people are real. If you've got five minutes to waste then read it and you'll discover that the discussion was about whether or not it was a big deal that the trans identified male graciously admitted to the training course, once admitted went straight to town complaining about the use of the word mother. He was in other words just there to grind his axe, and was obviously completely indifferent to the task of supporting a woman giving birth. Driven by the usual bog tedious unbelievably self inflated narcissism.
Then look at the second part of ZWs paragraph. This is supposed to be an analogy presumably. I don't think I've ever seen one misfiring so utterly as this one. What you're being asked Zoe is not to prove that animals (trans people) exist, you're being asked to demonstrate how a trans woman IS (not merely feels like he is but actually is) a woman. (or to extend your analogy how a kangaroo might actually be an octopus) Or to provide an example of a person who genuinely changed sex. (A leopard which changed its spots for stripes?) Or to find a man with a cervix. (A cat with an elephant trunk) And you can't do it. What you can do instead is to call an elephant a cat. By jiminy! See - there's a cat with an elephant trunk. I knew it was possible. Sex and gender is so much more complex than we learned in secondary school. You need to educate yourselves people and get with the times. Everything you once thought was fact has been overturned by science.
Maternity services have become troubled in many places. It's taken years and much suffering to even start to uncover it. Why isn't ZW fighting for that? Bizarre cultures, a lack of staff and safe practice, and the ignoring of the mother and her voice. Then the refusal to listen to the families (often fathers and grandfathers) when they raise issues. And your descriptions and analogies were so evocative - it's like those children's books where they're cut into sections and you can flip them over and mix and match the wrong bits of bodies.
My SJW daughter is now coming round to the idea that this ideology may actually be harmful to Women. She said, and I quote "I've been trying for over a year to become a Mother, and when I eventually do, they're going to try and take the title away from me. Well fuck that, no way, they're not getting away with it" ... who 'they' are that she's referencing isn't clear, but I think deep down she knows who THEY are. The tide is turning finally!! 👏👏👏
One can only hope. The 30-something women my husband works with seem utterly brain-damaged. Their fragile identities would topple if you took away their support of trans, prostitution, etc.
It's a middle-class phenomenon. Working-class kids outside of higher education know the score.
I am 89 and birthed 4 kids in 5 years, before I became a lesbian, I realised that lesbians also have no idea what it is to be a mother......so it is high time that we all look at our navel and remind ourselves where we came from!
While stomach-churning, this is an important read, and I am grateful you have put it together for all of us to share with others.
I really needed to read this today. It’s been nearly a year fighting Australia’s wreckless national breastfeeding organisation as it throws its doors wide open to these unstable men pretending to being breastfeeding mothers and expels anyone that tries to stop them.
One of the most primal words that we all share in some form or another... Mother. It must be like bitter ashes in their throat to even say it. Sadly nothing that these crazed lunatics get up to these days is surprising anymore, and perhaps that is the most insidious aspect of it.
Can you please do your best to tell your fellow men how destructive the crazed lunatics are? We need more male support to point out that the Emperor has no clothes.
I told the guys I work with about Sarah, the woman fighting for a women's only rape survivor's support group in Sussex. Most presumed all trans women had had the chop or when gay. I explained that with self id, any of them could claim to be a woman without even the need of slapping on some lipstick and attend a survivors group, no questions asked. When asked, how would you feel if it was your wife, sister or daughter having to relive her assault in front of a guy who may be there for legit reasons or may be there to top up the ol wa*k bank. That hit home.
At this point I think the people I work with might think I'm a stuck record. The Prof Stock case has been a real eye opener to a fair few of them though.
Thanks for the read this after breakfast warning. Thank you Genevieve and StillTish.
We know that pregnancy is a dangerous time for women because their male partners or relatives can get jealous and lacking the attention they want apparently makes them violent. Dynamics can shift. It is a known point where domestic abuse begins or escalates. Many pregnant women and mothers of babies and small children are at risk and need the use of safe spaces and shelter. BUT WHAT ABOUT THE MEN? WHAT ABOUT ME ME ME? What about the egos of the grown adult men who are having to adjust. Men abuse and kill women and their children when trying to escape this. Because leaving domestic abuse and coercive and controlling men is also a time of heightened risk. Anything that doesn't centre the man and his needs. Wider communities and families are still not understanding any of this. This is why we still need refuges and safe spaces and places. Sanctuary.
The more time that passes, the more this feels just like all the same old, same old. I once met a men's rights activist who had a bunch of ludicrous stats on how many women kill their partners. His visceral anger at his ex partner 'getting his kid' and his inability to see how he came across to me a complete stranger. It was instructive meeting him. I had to sit next to him in a workshop, but he revealed that he 'knew' me from around the town we live in. He'd worked in security and on the tills in shops and had seen me walk past over a number of years, or out and about, and therefore 'knew me'. He knew where I shopped. It was creepy. He was that type of unaware, verging on delusional and with the self-reinforcing fantasies that many men seem to comfort themselves with. Some women do this too, like Zoe Williams. How common is this twisted and warped male or misogynistic perception? They are the masters of the universe and they treat us like prey. That any violence towards women is deserved and she and we must have been nagging and asking for it.
This behaviour I see as the same. The sudden declaration or 'revelation of his true self' that a man identifies as a woman at that point in a woman's life is the same mess of envy, control, instability and inability to look outside of yourself and to the needs of others. I want, so I must have and own. If I can't have I must destroy. How is that any different from this bunch colonising our every experience? And not centering them is literal violence?
Pregnancy is just stuffing some plastic object up a hole to squeeze it out is it? And people - some men - are unable to separate this sexual fetish and pleasure from the act of carrying and giving birth? Then feeding and nurturing that child? There will be a snake oil salesman out there to sell us anything we can imagine or desire. Why are we pandering to this?
Reminds me and straight back to Mridul and the provision of safe spaces for vulnerable women and girls - this is the inability to distinguish male sexual violence and control from female pain or pleasure. And in a Rape Crisis Centre and travelling the UK to 'teach' communities about this. As some kind of expert. It's all the same to him. He shows his maleness through his public comments, let alone his actions, behaviour and inability to understand why. How is his demand to have women 'retrained' not yet more dominance and control. I don't want to imagine being a young mum going online as she needs help and support and facing this. Think of the men, as always, we must think of the men. Can we all do a check, is any man feeling some moment of doubt that this is all and always about him and his needs? Can't have that now can we?
Remember the laughability of penis envy? It's always been clear it's men envying women, not the other way around.
It's both fear and envy.
Thank you for that. Good points very well made.
Once the nausea passed, anger replaced this very quickly. Anger at other women, condoning this, and giving a helping hand in making us wither away, to what ? Pander to fetishists mimicking birth and feeding babies ?
Where did we go so wrong ?
How did this type of abomination become acceptable to those hashtag be kind types ?
The T can’t disappear from the LGB T, quick enough, this is not my world.
rant over 😞
I feel degraded having read that.
Thank goodness I read this before eating. I thought the faux pregnancy dude was sick enough, but seeing these disgusting creeps using hormones to force lactation to wank off is truly the most vomit inducing fetish I’ve seen. I recall seeing an article or a Twitter piece about a MTF who used hormones to actually breast feed a baby. I was disturbed by the fetish and furious at any medical professionals encouraging or condoning this practice. Pity that poor sweet baby, being fed a diet of synthetic hormones so a man can get some sick orgasmic thrill out of pretending to be a woman. That anyone could view that as anything other than gross child abuse and pedophilia is beyond me. Fucking criminal!
Yep, and the medical professionals bent over backwards to help him so he coukd have this 'experience'. Women that have issues are told get on with it or just use a bottle, they are made feel a failure and are judged for not breastfeeding.
To be a young mother-to-be in 2021 must feel like walking through a minefield. Enough! Time for kink-shaming to make a comeback. Push this all the way back to the rock from under which it crawled. Nasty, fetid nonsense.
Right. Some “kinks” deserve more than just being shamed. This is an absolute new low.
These men treat the world and all around them like their own great big sexual playground and people like Zoe Williams are little more than puppets.
Jeez, a hard read but a necessary one. Looks like some men will fetishise anything and see nothing wrong or shameful about it ☹️
Just when you think it can't get worse...boom!
… and who decides what we say and mean?
Who our are Overlords?
I feel sick, almost paralysed with revulsion...and an anger that is a TSUNAMI....spreading throughout me! I want to shout and scream and rage...and I want to confront all these sinisterly sick, mentally deranged humans who are allowing ANY of this to happen.
Thank you for highlight all these horrors... #WomenWontWheesht!
I’m sorry, this is the first post I couldn’t read. The sexualisation of babies actually makes me physically sick. I can’t read it, I just can’t.
A doula? Do they have midwives any more? They're presumably forbidden to call themselves midwives. But what depressingly mediocre journalism! The paragraph just before the one quoted in the article goes like this:
"One side of the debate doesn’t think trans people are real; they might feel what they feel, but the rest of us don’t have to join them in that reality. If someone tried to engage me in an animal rights debate in which I was first required to prove that animals existed, I’d ask them to come back later."
Aside from the fact that this is a straw man since nobody thinks trans people aren't real - only that objective models of reality cannot be built upon the subjective experiences of people who feel that they belong to the opposite sex they actually are - which is two quite different things - the discussion in ZWs article isn't actually about whether trans people are real. If you've got five minutes to waste then read it and you'll discover that the discussion was about whether or not it was a big deal that the trans identified male graciously admitted to the training course, once admitted went straight to town complaining about the use of the word mother. He was in other words just there to grind his axe, and was obviously completely indifferent to the task of supporting a woman giving birth. Driven by the usual bog tedious unbelievably self inflated narcissism.
Then look at the second part of ZWs paragraph. This is supposed to be an analogy presumably. I don't think I've ever seen one misfiring so utterly as this one. What you're being asked Zoe is not to prove that animals (trans people) exist, you're being asked to demonstrate how a trans woman IS (not merely feels like he is but actually is) a woman. (or to extend your analogy how a kangaroo might actually be an octopus) Or to provide an example of a person who genuinely changed sex. (A leopard which changed its spots for stripes?) Or to find a man with a cervix. (A cat with an elephant trunk) And you can't do it. What you can do instead is to call an elephant a cat. By jiminy! See - there's a cat with an elephant trunk. I knew it was possible. Sex and gender is so much more complex than we learned in secondary school. You need to educate yourselves people and get with the times. Everything you once thought was fact has been overturned by science.
It's childish language games and nothing more.
Maternity services have become troubled in many places. It's taken years and much suffering to even start to uncover it. Why isn't ZW fighting for that? Bizarre cultures, a lack of staff and safe practice, and the ignoring of the mother and her voice. Then the refusal to listen to the families (often fathers and grandfathers) when they raise issues. And your descriptions and analogies were so evocative - it's like those children's books where they're cut into sections and you can flip them over and mix and match the wrong bits of bodies.
Repellent