Gregor Murray just came up in the Maya Forstater trial. This is who she is alleged to have ‘misgendered’. This is who progressives have been defending all this time, while smearing not only Maya, but also JK Rowling, who defended her. The Guardian, The Independent, Owen Jones, Pink News, Joanne Harris, the BBC…all doing their utmost to protect a
Same Gregor Murray that was found guilty of being in breach of the councillors’ code of conduct by the Standards Commission at Dundee City Council - https://www.eveningtelegraph.co.uk/fp/woman-who-received-abuse-from-dundee-councillor-gregor-murray-speaks-out/ But he was picked on and wasn't properly supported by his party and "greeted" about it to whoever would listen. He has been abusing women for a long time...Gregor is not someone you would want to spend time with. His language and attitude are vile - even when he was a Councillor. He had a one-track mind and it wasn't his constituents. I come from Dundee although I live in Glasgow. Friends tried to complain about a visit they had with him and he went all "snot and tears" at the mediation meeting telling the Council they "misgendered him" and wouldn't apologise. How do you misgender anyone in a face-to-face meeting with 3 people?
The arguments today on the opposing side were atrocious. I don't just mean that I disagreed with the position being taken, but they failed to address the legal points at issue and instead launched into an emotional diatribe against MF. It was a more sedate version of the sort of trans hysteria we witness on twitter every day when someone points out unwelcome facts. It seemed like an effort to get as much shit said as possible - to invite the conclusion that, whatever the legalities, this is not a very nice person and you mustn't do or say anything that would affirm her.
In contrast Maya's lawyers were in another universe of legal expertise and professionalism - and above all they were on point. Any objective legal observer would have to say they won hands down. But we've seen what the tribunal made of the same situation and the unhinged ruling it handed down so God know's what the ruling will be here.
"Father Ted tweet sparks row between Dundee councillors"
Dundee Evening Telegraph, September 30, 2017
A councillor has been criticised for mocking Labour rivals with a Father Ted gag.
Councillor Gregor Murray, convener of Dundee City Council’s children and families services committee, irked opposition councillors by making jokes on social media, tweeting: “Trying to explain to Labour the difference between 2017 and 2020.
The hashtag was apparently a reference to a scene in the Father Ted episode “Hell”, in which an exasperated Ted uses a plastic toy to explain to Dougall the concept of perspective and distance.
A meeting saw councillors discuss the planned expansion of early years and child care from 600 hours to 1,140 hours by 2020.
Labour’s Charlie Malone claimed that Councillor Murray posted the tweet as council business was taking place — and said that the councillor should be focusing on debates in the chamber.
But Councillor Murray insisted the tweet was posted after the committee meeting had taken place.
Councillor Malone said: “The convener thinks it’s funny to tweet Father Ted jokes which are clearly targeted at myself and Michael Marra. I think given the fact we’re dealing with serious stuff like nursery provision, to be tweeting this stuff isn’t right.”
Back in July, Councillor Murray was criticised for branding members of a women’s group “absolute roasters” on Twitter. The SNP politician refused to apologise, but later said his language was “probably not acceptable”.
Tweeting is allowed during council meetings but Councillor Malone claims the Labour Group does not use social media during the debates, adding: “There’s a time and a place for humour on Twitter, but it’s happening during debates when people should be paying attention. It’s something I’ll be speaking to John Alexander about.”
In response, Councillor Murray said: “The children and families committee had finished and I had tweeted my opinion of how I felt it had went.
“Some of the questions from his colleagues were embarrassing. It was clear that once more the papers we were discussing just simply had not been read by some members.
“I think that is far more disrespectful to our city.”
We are a group of 51 women from various professions and walks of life across Scotland, and who are very concerned at the climate of misogyny and violent threats against women currently being fomented by the culture of trans ideology.
In particular we are concerned at the very recent behaviour of SNP councillor Gregor Fisher Murray when he launched an expletive ridden tirade of abuse at women who were expressing their concern over threats against lesbians defining their own boundaries and their own sexuality. Please see the article in today’s The Courier.
This is not the first time that he has displayed such impulses, previously having attacked those who want 50/50 representation as ‘feminist shite’.
Gillian Martin’s non-aggressive comments of some years ago had consequences for her but Gregor Murray’s behaviour, which is recent and repeated, have had no such repercussions for him. We call upon you to send a clear message, that discourse around these matters must be respectful and non-threatening. The fact that this person identifies as non-binary clearly hasn’t prevented him from adopting intimidating behaviour typical of male aggressors, and promoting blatant sexism. Women’s and children’s rights are not safe in his hands. He is not acceptable as an ‘equalities spokesperson’, nor as convenor of a children and families committee. We call upon you to stand up for women and send a message that this language and behaviour will not be tolerated in the SNP.
Since our letter to the First Minister, the SNP Councillor Gregor Fisher Murray has resigned from his positions as Children’s Convener and Equalities Spokesperson. However, he still remains as Councillor for Dundee and a member of the SNP. See the article in the Courier of 10 August 2018.
This is our response:
It is a shame, if unsurprising, that it has taken Councillor Murray so long to realise that his offensive and misogynist outbursts on social media are incompatible with his role as children’s convenor for Dundee council. It is also dispiriting to note the ineffective response of the SNP and the fact that Murray continues to hold his seat.
Mr Murray’s freely expressed contempt for women would be bad enough. However, as children’s convenor, his behaviour and opinions on the subject of gender roles are downright disturbing and highlight the worrying implications of the recent Scottish Government’s proposal to teach children in primary one about “gender identity”. Under these proposals, children will, apparently, be told that sex is what “a doctor tells you are” but “gender is what you decide”.
We believe passionately that sex-role stereotypes and gendered expectations are pernicious and harmful and we fully support the equality policies in our schools. We welcome any drive to strengthen these existing policies and encourage children to look beyond societal expectations. The notion that little girls can play football or that little boys can be sensitive should be encouraged.
Unfortunately, the positive nature of this guidance is rendered meaningless by the muddled advice that children can “decide if they are a boy or a girl”. On what basis, do we suppose, very young children will make this decision other than a preference for certain gendered behaviours, dress or activities? In effect, this reinforces rigid ideas of masculine and feminine traits.
Councillor Murray, it would appear, clearly believes in the power of gender stereotypes – so much so that, despite being a bearded biological male, he believes that a liking for ‘chick flicks’ and the occasional application of nail polish entitles him to claim “trans” status. Not only is this deeply insulting to those who suffer from genuine dysphoria – reducing and trivializing their struggle – it encourages the notion that men and women should conform absolutely to a set of regressive expectations. When this is built into the curriculum, it reinforces the belief that if a child fails to conform they are somehow not a ‘real’ boy or girl. Ironically, the standard taunt of playground bullies is being given official sanction in the curriculum and is, no doubt, being cheered on by party members like Mr Murray with similarly backward and conservative views on male and female roles.
We are firmly committed to the principle of challenging any sexist or reductive expectations. We would welcome any suggestions from individuals like Mr Murray that men, as well as women, can wear a variety of clothing, sparkles or paint their nails. However, his ridiculous assertion that a minor transgression from restrictive artificial gendered behaviour is sufficient to override science and make one less of a man is deeply damaging to attempts to expand horizons for boys and girls.
Similarly, the advice in the proposed education reforms may be well-intentioned but by suggesting that a child’s behaviour and preferences determine gender it is also perpetuating this dangerous ideology. We would, therefore, urge Education Scotland and the Scottish Government to reconsider the proposals.
1 THOUGHT ON “RESPONSE TO GREGOR FISHER MURRAY’S RESIGNATION AS CHILDREN’S CONVENOR”
Morag Lennie on 13th August 2018 at 1:24 pm said:
At the age of 73 , having always considered myself to be a fairly clued in kind of person , I now find I have to get my head around non binary trans gendered men , and , while I may be wrong , it does seem to me to be predominantly men , who want to put on a wig , slap on a bit of lippy, and call themselves a woman , while hanging on to their dangly bits ( lit and fig ) and not undergoing gender realignment.
Sorry guys , I’m not buying it. Be assured , that if I ever go into a changing room , public lavatory , or take my granddaughters to public swimming baths , and find , what is , to all intents and purposes , a man , notwithstanding the wig and lippy, your dangly bits will be in serious jeopardy.
As it happens , I know , and have had run ins with him , on feminism , before he decided he was both male and female. I wonder if his attitude to feminism has changed now.
On a slightly catty note , I really don’t know what kind of a woman look he can achieve , because even as a man , God love him , he’s no bonnie.
=================
God love him , he’s no bonnie. 😂
=================
"Scouting for Boys: How the wearing of a hat shows character"
This Gregor Murray...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-48295000
I felt very emotional following the live tweeting today. The magnitude of this case cannot be overstated.
A lot of - what I think used to be known as - pious perjury in that submission today. After all, when you've no facts it's all there is.
The person in the photo above is a man
Surely Compelled speech is Coercive Control? We should be using this legislation in Ireland at least to fight these miserable AGP Trolls.
https://www.safeireland.ie/wp-content/uploads/Safe-Ireland-Coercive-Control-Leaflet.pdf
Same Gregor Murray that was found guilty of being in breach of the councillors’ code of conduct by the Standards Commission at Dundee City Council - https://www.eveningtelegraph.co.uk/fp/woman-who-received-abuse-from-dundee-councillor-gregor-murray-speaks-out/ But he was picked on and wasn't properly supported by his party and "greeted" about it to whoever would listen. He has been abusing women for a long time...Gregor is not someone you would want to spend time with. His language and attitude are vile - even when he was a Councillor. He had a one-track mind and it wasn't his constituents. I come from Dundee although I live in Glasgow. Friends tried to complain about a visit they had with him and he went all "snot and tears" at the mediation meeting telling the Council they "misgendered him" and wouldn't apologise. How do you misgender anyone in a face-to-face meeting with 3 people?
The arguments today on the opposing side were atrocious. I don't just mean that I disagreed with the position being taken, but they failed to address the legal points at issue and instead launched into an emotional diatribe against MF. It was a more sedate version of the sort of trans hysteria we witness on twitter every day when someone points out unwelcome facts. It seemed like an effort to get as much shit said as possible - to invite the conclusion that, whatever the legalities, this is not a very nice person and you mustn't do or say anything that would affirm her.
In contrast Maya's lawyers were in another universe of legal expertise and professionalism - and above all they were on point. Any objective legal observer would have to say they won hands down. But we've seen what the tribunal made of the same situation and the unhinged ruling it handed down so God know's what the ruling will be here.
Thats a fine looking scout troupe
This is a good one! 😂
"Father Ted tweet sparks row between Dundee councillors"
Dundee Evening Telegraph, September 30, 2017
A councillor has been criticised for mocking Labour rivals with a Father Ted gag.
Councillor Gregor Murray, convener of Dundee City Council’s children and families services committee, irked opposition councillors by making jokes on social media, tweeting: “Trying to explain to Labour the difference between 2017 and 2020.
“It’s difficult #TheseCowsAreNear #ThoseCowsAreFarAway.”
The hashtag was apparently a reference to a scene in the Father Ted episode “Hell”, in which an exasperated Ted uses a plastic toy to explain to Dougall the concept of perspective and distance.
A meeting saw councillors discuss the planned expansion of early years and child care from 600 hours to 1,140 hours by 2020.
Labour’s Charlie Malone claimed that Councillor Murray posted the tweet as council business was taking place — and said that the councillor should be focusing on debates in the chamber.
But Councillor Murray insisted the tweet was posted after the committee meeting had taken place.
Councillor Malone said: “The convener thinks it’s funny to tweet Father Ted jokes which are clearly targeted at myself and Michael Marra. I think given the fact we’re dealing with serious stuff like nursery provision, to be tweeting this stuff isn’t right.”
Back in July, Councillor Murray was criticised for branding members of a women’s group “absolute roasters” on Twitter. The SNP politician refused to apologise, but later said his language was “probably not acceptable”.
Tweeting is allowed during council meetings but Councillor Malone claims the Labour Group does not use social media during the debates, adding: “There’s a time and a place for humour on Twitter, but it’s happening during debates when people should be paying attention. It’s something I’ll be speaking to John Alexander about.”
In response, Councillor Murray said: “The children and families committee had finished and I had tweeted my opinion of how I felt it had went.
“Some of the questions from his colleagues were embarrassing. It was clear that once more the papers we were discussing just simply had not been read by some members.
“I think that is far more disrespectful to our city.”
https://www.eveningtelegraph.co.uk/fp/father-ted-tweet-sparksrow-between-councillors/
================
"Open Letter to First Minister"
forwomen.scot 13th July 2018
Dear Nicola Sturgeon, First Minister,
We are a group of 51 women from various professions and walks of life across Scotland, and who are very concerned at the climate of misogyny and violent threats against women currently being fomented by the culture of trans ideology.
In particular we are concerned at the very recent behaviour of SNP councillor Gregor Fisher Murray when he launched an expletive ridden tirade of abuse at women who were expressing their concern over threats against lesbians defining their own boundaries and their own sexuality. Please see the article in today’s The Courier.
This is not the first time that he has displayed such impulses, previously having attacked those who want 50/50 representation as ‘feminist shite’.
Gillian Martin’s non-aggressive comments of some years ago had consequences for her but Gregor Murray’s behaviour, which is recent and repeated, have had no such repercussions for him. We call upon you to send a clear message, that discourse around these matters must be respectful and non-threatening. The fact that this person identifies as non-binary clearly hasn’t prevented him from adopting intimidating behaviour typical of male aggressors, and promoting blatant sexism. Women’s and children’s rights are not safe in his hands. He is not acceptable as an ‘equalities spokesperson’, nor as convenor of a children and families committee. We call upon you to stand up for women and send a message that this language and behaviour will not be tolerated in the SNP.
Yours sincerely,
forwomen.scot
==============
"Response to Gregor Fisher Murray’s Resignation as Children’s Convenor"
forwomen.scot 12th August 2018
Since our letter to the First Minister, the SNP Councillor Gregor Fisher Murray has resigned from his positions as Children’s Convener and Equalities Spokesperson. However, he still remains as Councillor for Dundee and a member of the SNP. See the article in the Courier of 10 August 2018.
This is our response:
It is a shame, if unsurprising, that it has taken Councillor Murray so long to realise that his offensive and misogynist outbursts on social media are incompatible with his role as children’s convenor for Dundee council. It is also dispiriting to note the ineffective response of the SNP and the fact that Murray continues to hold his seat.
Mr Murray’s freely expressed contempt for women would be bad enough. However, as children’s convenor, his behaviour and opinions on the subject of gender roles are downright disturbing and highlight the worrying implications of the recent Scottish Government’s proposal to teach children in primary one about “gender identity”. Under these proposals, children will, apparently, be told that sex is what “a doctor tells you are” but “gender is what you decide”.
We believe passionately that sex-role stereotypes and gendered expectations are pernicious and harmful and we fully support the equality policies in our schools. We welcome any drive to strengthen these existing policies and encourage children to look beyond societal expectations. The notion that little girls can play football or that little boys can be sensitive should be encouraged.
Unfortunately, the positive nature of this guidance is rendered meaningless by the muddled advice that children can “decide if they are a boy or a girl”. On what basis, do we suppose, very young children will make this decision other than a preference for certain gendered behaviours, dress or activities? In effect, this reinforces rigid ideas of masculine and feminine traits.
Councillor Murray, it would appear, clearly believes in the power of gender stereotypes – so much so that, despite being a bearded biological male, he believes that a liking for ‘chick flicks’ and the occasional application of nail polish entitles him to claim “trans” status. Not only is this deeply insulting to those who suffer from genuine dysphoria – reducing and trivializing their struggle – it encourages the notion that men and women should conform absolutely to a set of regressive expectations. When this is built into the curriculum, it reinforces the belief that if a child fails to conform they are somehow not a ‘real’ boy or girl. Ironically, the standard taunt of playground bullies is being given official sanction in the curriculum and is, no doubt, being cheered on by party members like Mr Murray with similarly backward and conservative views on male and female roles.
We are firmly committed to the principle of challenging any sexist or reductive expectations. We would welcome any suggestions from individuals like Mr Murray that men, as well as women, can wear a variety of clothing, sparkles or paint their nails. However, his ridiculous assertion that a minor transgression from restrictive artificial gendered behaviour is sufficient to override science and make one less of a man is deeply damaging to attempts to expand horizons for boys and girls.
Similarly, the advice in the proposed education reforms may be well-intentioned but by suggesting that a child’s behaviour and preferences determine gender it is also perpetuating this dangerous ideology. We would, therefore, urge Education Scotland and the Scottish Government to reconsider the proposals.
forwomen.scot
1 THOUGHT ON “RESPONSE TO GREGOR FISHER MURRAY’S RESIGNATION AS CHILDREN’S CONVENOR”
Morag Lennie on 13th August 2018 at 1:24 pm said:
At the age of 73 , having always considered myself to be a fairly clued in kind of person , I now find I have to get my head around non binary trans gendered men , and , while I may be wrong , it does seem to me to be predominantly men , who want to put on a wig , slap on a bit of lippy, and call themselves a woman , while hanging on to their dangly bits ( lit and fig ) and not undergoing gender realignment.
Sorry guys , I’m not buying it. Be assured , that if I ever go into a changing room , public lavatory , or take my granddaughters to public swimming baths , and find , what is , to all intents and purposes , a man , notwithstanding the wig and lippy, your dangly bits will be in serious jeopardy.
As it happens , I know , and have had run ins with him , on feminism , before he decided he was both male and female. I wonder if his attitude to feminism has changed now.
On a slightly catty note , I really don’t know what kind of a woman look he can achieve , because even as a man , God love him , he’s no bonnie.
=================
God love him , he’s no bonnie. 😂
=================
"Scouting for Boys: How the wearing of a hat shows character"
https://twitter.com/GenderWang/status/1387535878340456458
https://archive.ph/ybGg7